Please don't go down this road unless you are equally willing to throw out aberrantly poor performances as well as consider the fact that many, if not all, teams' statistics are skewed by a small number of outstanding games as well.

Further, excluding the games Quinn did not start necessarily eliminates an important controlling point, ie: maybe the running game is so dreadful in large part BECAUSE Quinn is so dreadful. Note that this wouldn't really be expected, considering the equally or greater dreadfulness of Derek. But lo, the Browns managed games with 146, 171, and 164 with Anderson at QB.

Barring an exhaustive statistical analysis, which would include drawing distribution curves, calculating variance and standard deviations (yes, RedDawg, I do know quite a bit about mathematics and data analysis ), I also noted that the average rushing gain for the Browns is 4.2, or right exactly smack dab in the middle of the pack. We could adjust for Cribbs, although if we do that then we would need to go through all of the data and adjust for all wild cat packages, as well as QB scrambles, end arounds, reverses, and assorted trick plays. Of course, completely eliminating these also eliminates the advantage a QB gains from having big plays or productivity in the running game apart from drawing the defense a bit closer, ie: better scoring opportunities.

I'm not making the argument our running game was top 10, only a fool would think so. But I would consider it within a standard deviation of the average, or average to slightly below average. And I agree Jamal Lewis sucked. I agreed with that a year ago.

One final note: I'm sure we can both agree that a running game can make a passing game look better/worse, and vice versa. Which one do you think has had the more adverse effect on the other for the 2009 Cleveland Browns? Gotta be the passing game hamstringing the running game, right?

Personally on the QB situtation i think he will trade/sign a quarterback and get rid off DA (no way he can run WCO). Keep Quinn as a back up. I wouldn't be suprised if he trades for Wallace from SEA, when he went to SEA he traded with Green Bay for Hasselback so he would be basically doing the same with Wallace.

ao,

Good stuff. And yes, Josh Cribbs' gaudy 6.8 YPC certainly had a very positive effect on the teams rushing YPC. Some of those were jet sweeps from the WR position, but most were from the Wildcat.


Let's narrow it down to two questions.

1. Did you, or did you not think we had one of the worst running games in the NFL for the majority of the season, for both Quinn and Anderson?


2. Might clearly substandard WRs - by NFL standards - be as much or more the reason why the passing game hamstrung the offense?



Since you're a math guy, I'll swing it over to my area which is science. There are so MANY variables that affect QB play, I think its very difficult for the average joe, or even knowlegable football fans to assess QB performance and potential. Except SoulDawg of course. I'm quite satisfied that Holmgren will have the data necessary to make an educated decision about Quinn's potential in whatever system is implemented in CLE.

I just wanted to point out that a lack of a running game certainly allowed defenses to keep 7 or even 6 in the box and use the safeties to double BE when he was here, then MassaQ. Is it the QB, the WR, or parts of both?

It's also very possible that the lack of a valid deep threat at WR also impinged on the production of both the passing game, and the offense as a whole.

What's really AMAZING is that Harrison is tearing it up even when 2 bad, yet still NFL defenses are rolling safeties down and playing the run - yet still we mash it down the field despite our poor QB and/or WR play. That means our OL is actually pretty close to kickass already, which we do have going for us in 2010.

History would suggest that, yes.

Agree. Don't be shocked if we trade a third or even second for Wallace.

Oh sure, what we've got here is a feedback loop of suck, with each part of the offense making each other part worse and on and on into eternity.

I just happen to think that it was the lack of a passing game impacting the running game more than vice versa; the passing game is clearly amongst the worst in the NFL (both due to the WRs and QBs likely, although you are correct that I have no way of disentangling the two), the running game is NFL average. If you tried to correct for things like Cribbs, I'm pretty confident you would emerge with a running game that is slightly below average.
FO adjusts for defenses: http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamoff
15th running, 29th passing

Agreed that our OL is actually quite awesome. It damn well better be, considering there are 3 huge contracts on it.